TOMCAT - Posted - 04/07/2015:  11:02:14

I'm presently playing the first tpf banjo I ever owned. It's hard to pin point but the tone is just different. I dont mean necessarily darker , brighter, type different but I guess the word would be more complex if that makes any since. I like it. I just don't understand really why it does what it does.

Edited by - TOMCAT on 04/07/2015 11:03:58

jonc - Posted - 04/07/2015:  12:28:42

good for you, I didn't like it, a little tinny, or thin. For me, the one piece is more robust.

Bob Miller - Posted - 04/07/2015:  12:37:33

I agree with you Tom.  I like the two piece flange sound better.  I also have a one piece flange but it seems to fade up the neck.

Bob Miller        

"If this ain't bluegrass, grits ain't groceries" 

TOMCAT - Posted - 04/07/2015:  13:26:34

Yeah kinda opened up a whole new world of banjodom for me. Ha.

roydsjr - Posted - 04/07/2015:  13:49:25

I like that it does not warp upward like the one piece does from over tightening the head! I have several one piece and one 2 piece and I really like it!

Helix - Posted - 04/07/2015:  14:03:16

I've been making tube openbacks for a few years, no holes in the rim, I love the lightweight of the plate with the rez.

I have a pot metal flange I took to the bandsaw, works great, less filling.

Black Cherry Blossom #001 showing Fresnel ledges

vincekinney - Posted - 04/07/2015:  14:13:13

Wait long enough and the two pc, will be in vogue ...as they say.If you like the sound ,play it.Im looking to put a archtop together ,never had one . Id love to get a RK archtop ring ,but ive been told by dealers their no longer available.!Id go with a two pc. flange any day.

TOMCAT - Posted - 04/07/2015:  14:22:27

Yeah I've gotten interested in the RK 30 now. I love my RB 800. This one may be the keeper I been looking for

REarl - Posted - 04/07/2015:  14:39:29

From all that I can tell the sound difference between the OPF and the TPF are related to the rim being thicker with the TPF and the back of the resonator sitting further from the rim, which causes the volume of the sounding chamber to be larger. There are some flattops that came originally with a TPF, but not many, at least in comparison to those with a OPF. The TPF is often associated with an archtop tone ring and there is, obviously, a difference between a flattop and an archtop. That difference is what some seem to attribute to the sound of the TPF, but it's not the flange, it's the ring. The TPF is also much stronger than the OPF, but it is more expensive and more difficult to make.

I have banjos with both, but I prefer the TPF.

Ken LeVan - Posted - 04/07/2015:  14:41:25

TPFs are different than OPFs, for one thing, the rim is thicker, which is a giant thing.

They are NOT the same - the TPF rim has much more mass - forget about the tone ring - just look at the rim:

Thinking that it is the flange that makes the difference is like thinking it's how many holes in a tone ring that makes one tone ring sound different from another - ascribing the wrong cause to an effect - there is much more to it than the flange.

TOMCAT - Posted - 04/07/2015:  14:50:41

Great info!

Julio B - Posted - 04/07/2015:  15:44:23

quote:

---

Originally posted by TOMCAT

Great info!

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I gladly second that!  Great explanation!

~Julio (who has/plays both)

swamplunker - Posted - 04/07/2015:  16:15:13

So the wood is different as Ken points out, the metal is different as nearly everyone mentioned, and, as Richard Davis points out, the size of the sound cavity, or what Roger Siminoff calls the "aperture" is also different. Three major variables.

REarl - Posted - 04/07/2015:  18:12:37

As I understand it the aperture is the distance between the resonator and the bottom of the rim. The sound cavity is the entire space between the head and the bottom of the rim. A larger aperture will produce a larger sound cavity. However, interestingly enough, the effect of the two is opposite in terms of the tone produced. A large sound cavity produces a lower resonant frequency, while a larger aperture produces a higher resonant frequency. All the fun of playing around with banjos.

swamplunker - Posted - 04/07/2015:  19:44:39

The best way I know of to play around with the air chamber without altering their banjo is to get a set of Raejusters and try raising and lowering the pot assembly in the resonator until you get a tone you like. You can't lower it, of course, any more than it was in the first place but raising it different amounts will make a serious difference, you'll just never hear two Bluegrassers sitting around, saying, "nice resonant frequency".

TOMCAT - Posted - 04/07/2015:  20:12:10

I have mine raised about 3/16 . Boosted it pretty good.

PJRedWing - Posted - 04/08/2015:  05:29:40

I always wonder if TPF banjos benefited from higher string gauges, given the increased rim mass that needs to  vibrate. I use mediums on my tube and plate banjer and am quite happy with the sound. Never tried lights on her.

TOMCAT - Posted - 04/08/2015:  05:45:57

I never thought of it that way Patrick, but that does make you think. Kinda like it takes a bigger man to shake a bigger tree to get the apples to fall.

Helix - Posted - 04/08/2015:  06:07:15

I forgot to mention there is more mass in the TPF rim, it's upside down actually. They rock

I really hate taking great hardwood down to 10-3/4" for what the Canadian guy called "standard bluegrass measurements."

Thanks REarl, I wondered where the bass came from with less aperture.