banjo bill-e - Posted - 05/27/2015:  13:36:52

Playing my Ramsey with a Balch Goatskin head on a very rainy day, and figured that the natural hide would suffer in tone. Au contraire! Sounding really fine today, no idea as to why. But this Woody has always reacted strongly to big changes in weather, sometimes better, sometimes worse, but this was a surprise as I did not think that hide heads and humidity were a good mix. But today at least, it's working well. 

revellfa - Posted - 05/27/2015:  14:30:02

I've not had such good luck here in the humid Mid-Atlantic. I took my head off and gave her a second coat of leather sealer, and then a third, and I might give her a forth sometime soon and then reinstall.

I think goatskin since it tends to be thicker handles humidity better than thin calfskin. Just my opinion...

Crusty - Posted - 05/27/2015:  15:35:11

Doesn't John treat his hide heads with a waterproofer to inhibit humidity changes?

Calfskin - there's many different thicknesses of it.  The calfskins from Elderly are pretty thick - thicker than goatskins.

RG - Posted - 05/27/2015:  17:24:13

The medium goatskins from Elderly are as thick as their cow hides, I've used them for years, use square brass stock to turn my flesh hoops, once mounted I've had very little movement in the hide, I find goat to be much more stable than cow hide...don't use any waterproofing...

BrendanD - Posted - 05/27/2015:  23:12:40

I've had several calfskin heads on my 1925 Vega Tubaphone (with steel strings) over the years, with the current head being quite thin. I have a calfskin (I think) head on my Jere Canote fretless (with Nylgut strings) as well. I live in dry northern California, but both banjos sound their very best at Clifftop, where it can be very humid indeed, especially at night. I tend to crank down the heads while I'm there, and I monitor them closely for changing humidity so they don't break when the weather dries out, but when I get the tension just right my Tubaphone rings like a bell at Clifftop. Somehow the humidity seems to damp out the harshest overtones without muddying the sound. The secret is to carefully adjust the head tension - I find there's a tension point at which the volume increases and the notes seem to pop out of the instrument with little effort.

celtic trad - Posted - 05/28/2015:  13:28:34

I run sound for irish/celtic trad performers ... the instrument here that has a goat skin and is problematic with humidity is the the bodran... irish drum


the strategies that i have seen artists use vary.... mist sprayer and cloth for dry condition... and for humidity there's small hair driers ...
the easiest thing I've seem so far is a heating pad... stuff one in the back of your rig to keep the skin tight...

raw skin is sought after for the tone.... living with it takes a bit more effort

I did hear you can keep a light bulb mounted in the hoop behind the skin too

Cottonmouth - Posted - 05/28/2015:  14:35:47

A few years ago, while on a TN trip, I visited John Balch and left my 1910 Fairbanks-Vega 10-1/8" Tu-ba-phone rim with him. After installing his 3-star goatskin head, stained and moisture-treated, he shipped it back to my deep South home near Mobile Bay and the Gulf of Mexico. Folks, heat and humidity reign down here, but it has NOT affected my banjo in the least, indoors or out. I play weekly in an outdoor acoustic jam on a creek running off Mobile Bay and my banjo stays in tune; no problems. I know John has told us what he uses to condition these heads with, so it is no mystery and you can certainly depend on it!

banjo bill-e - Posted - 05/28/2015:  15:56:52

----"Somehow the humidity seems to damp out the harshest overtones without muddying the sound."

Bingo, Brendan, perfect description of what I was hearing. I was getting the elusive "plunky yet still clear and bright" tone, which is often sought in vain. I have not touched the tension since a week after mounting this head over a year ago and it has not needed anything.

Paul S - Posted - 05/28/2015:  16:10:31

Bill, may I ask what strings you use with that goatskin head?

BrendanD - Posted - 05/28/2015:  16:33:42

quote:

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Originally posted by banjo bill-e

----"Somehow the humidity seems to damp out the harshest overtones without muddying the sound."



Bingo, Brendan, perfect description of what I was hearing. I was getting the elusive "plunky yet still clear and bright" tone, which is often sought in vain. I have not touched the tension since a week after mounting this head over a year ago and it has not needed anything.

---

I should add that none of my skin heads have been treated or moisture-proofed in any way. Since I've never treated my skin heads, I can't say how that would affect the sound, but it has occurred to me that preventing the head from absorbing moisture might also prevent it from sounding so good when the weather's humid! At least for me, It's really controlling the head tension that's the key to getting great sound in damp weather. But some heads are more stable than others despite changes in humidity, and it sounds like that's the case for your Balch goatskin. Is it treated in any way? If so, perhaps the head absorbs just enough moisture to damp the harshest harmonics without also stretching excessively - which might kind of address my concerns about treating a skin head. If that's in fact the case, it sounds like you have the best of both worlds!

banjo bill-e - Posted - 05/28/2015:  17:10:29

Paul, I only use steel strings on the Ramsey and this time it's mediums, I forget which brand but I think it was GHS this time. I am not particular about brand and buy whatever is cheapest in the gauges I want. All of the sound bad at first, and all of them sound fine later as they settle in. Because of this I have never gotten a handle on a best brand. I often think at first that I like or dislike a new set compared to the previous, but give me a week and I won't really be able to tell the difference.

Brendan, my first surprise on installing the Goatskin head was that is was as loud or louder than my Ren head, and even my wife noticed it (I think that she was hoping for a muting effect). Also, the combo of Woody, 12" rim, plus natural hide head would seem to be the recipe for a darker tone, but this Woody has always been surprisingly bright and usually not plunky at all, and the hide head did not change that. I got a cool looking head that made less noise from contact and which rolled off just a touch of shrillness I was getting from the Ren head, and which required a lighter amount of stuffing, but is still plenty bright if that is the tone which you want to bring out. All the changes were subtle but all were improvements and I heartily endorse the John Balch Goatskins.

The day I posted, I was getting a new and most pleasant plunk without any tubbiness or dullness, which I liked quite a lot. I've been out of town since posting and will find tomorrow if it is a lasting effect.

BrendanD - Posted - 05/28/2015:  21:03:11

quote:

---

Originally posted by banjo bill-e

Brendan, my first surprise on installing the Goatskin head was that is was as loud or louder than my Ren head, and even my wife noticed it (I think that she was hoping for a muting effect). Also, the combo of Woody, 12" rim, plus natural hide head would seem to be the recipe for a darker tone, but this Woody has always been surprisingly bright and usually not plunky at all, and the hide head did not change that. I got a cool looking head that made less noise from contact and which rolled off just a touch of shrillness I was getting from the Ren head, and which required a lighter amount of stuffing, but is still plenty bright if that is the tone which you want to bring out. All the changes were subtle but all were improvements and I heartily endorse the John Balch Goatskins.



The day I posted, I was getting a new and most pleasant plunk without any tubbiness or dullness, which I liked quite a lot. I've been out of town since posting and will find tomorrow if it is a lasting effect.

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Bill, is your Balch goatskin head treated in any way for moisture resistance?