WaltV - Posted - 03/04/2017:  22:26:45

Wow, what a beautiful instrument!  Very happy with it, I've been playing it all night. 

Nicely packed in a Martin Guitar box from Elderly. That created a few questions from my wife when she received the shipment - did I just buy another Martin Guitar and not tell her??

Question - are banjos generally shipped with no tension on the head? The tensioning nuts were barely finger tight. This surprised me but maybe it makes sense.  The bridge was laying down and was cushioned. 

Tightened the head and threw on my Snuffy Smith bridge and it's good to go.

I'm assuming it was otherwise set up like it says on their website; string height is right above the 5/32" line. Does that sound about right?

Elderly installed a set of 5th string spikes no charge, which is their norm. 

Thanks for all the help while I was lurking here doing my research. 

Walt

Edited by - WaltV on 03/04/2017 22:29:44

twelvefret - Posted - 03/05/2017:  04:33:18

Congratulations on your banjo.

I do not know about shipping banjos, but always loosed the tension on the strings of fiddles I have mailed.

jbalch - Posted - 03/05/2017:  06:12:43

Loosening the head for shipping is not usually necessary...but it can't hurt.  I assume Elderly may have been extra cautious.  Loosening strings and laying the bridge down is always a good idea.

That seems like nice, low string action - do you like it?   Reiter banjos are handmade - so there is some degree of variation among them.  But they are often made to have low action (when set up with a 5/8" bridge).  I have known Bart to include extra bridges at a couple of different heights - so the player can choose. What height is your Snuffy bridge?  Some folks may prefer the string height a little higher.  If you do, just try a slightly taller bridge.  I use an 11/16" bridge on my bacophone-plus to raise the strings just a tad....

Enjoy!

R.D. Lunceford - Posted - 03/05/2017:  08:50:44

quote:

---

Originally posted by WaltV

Question - are banjos generally shipped with no tension on the head? The tensioning nuts were barely finger tight. This surprised me but maybe it makes sense.  The bridge was laying down and was cushioned. 

I'm assuming it was otherwise set up like it says on their website; string height is right above the 5/32" line. Does that sound about right?

 

Walt

---

It isn't a bad idea to loosen the head tension, but for myself, I've only loosened the head tension on my banjos if they are skin heads...usually if I am flying.  With a skin, going from one climate to another is a good reason to loosen the head.  For example, from rainy southern Washington to arid souther California.  Plastic I don't worry about, but again, no harm in loosening those either.  As for strings and bridge, it's *always* a good idea to loosen them as Elderly did with your banjo.

String height is a personal preference.  A lot of  CHers go with a higher action.  My banjos have either 11/16 or 3/4 bridges on them.  3/4 is the tallest off the shelf bridge I've seen.  David Cunningham of DC Banjoworks makes excellent bridges of varying heights with super-precision and quality woods: banjohangout.org/reviews/searc...edir=true  Check out the 2-footed model he made for me on his website.

Enjoy your new banjo.  Reiters are 100% quality.

Edited by - R.D. Lunceford on 03/05/2017 08:52:47

mjt0229 - Posted - 03/05/2017:  12:43:05

I have a couple of David Cunningham's bridges, including two of the two-footed model he made for R.D. and I like them very much.

WaltV - Posted - 03/05/2017:  20:37:14

It's all very comfortable to me. I like the setup and action very much, but I had to get used to it. I thought it was high at first, but with the comments here and what I've been reading, the setup is just right. I think I was digging to much on my Goodtime with the 1/8" action and no scoop. I have much more control with this setup, and the tone! Wow. I didn't think it would be so different from my Goodtime. The Goodtime served me well as a student banjo, but this is just beyond an upgrade. Very happy with it.

jbalch - Posted - 03/07/2017:  14:42:37

Walter:

Bart's banjos respond well to your set-up preferences.  As others have said, string height is a personal choice.  If you prefer lower action, there is nothing wrong with trying a shorter bridge.

Best wishes!

alubin - Posted - 03/07/2017:  14:51:13

I ordered a Ramsey fretless from Elderly about a year ago, and the fiberskyn head did not seem to have been loosened at all, just the strings. Of course, it was only going from Lansing to Chicago, so maybe they didn't think it was necessary.

rudy - Posted - 03/08/2017:  06:50:56

quote:

---

Originally posted by WaltV

 

Wow, what a beautiful instrument!  Very happy with it, I've been playing it all night. 

Nicely packed in a Martin Guitar box from Elderly. That created a few questions from my wife when she received the shipment - did I just buy another Martin Guitar and not tell her??

Question - are banjos generally shipped with no tension on the head? The tensioning nuts were barely finger tight. This surprised me but maybe it makes sense.  The bridge was laying down and was cushioned. 

Tightened the head and threw on my Snuffy Smith bridge and it's good to go.

I'm assuming it was otherwise set up like it says on their website; string height is right above the 5/32" line. Does that sound about right?

Elderly installed a set of 5th string spikes no charge, which is their norm. 

Thanks for all the help while I was lurking here doing my research. 

Walt

---

Congratulations on the new jo!

I think it's very odd that the head wasn't tensioned correctly.  There's absolutely no reason why a synthetic head should be loosened for shipment and I find it difficult to believe that it was done intentionally.  I don't believe I've ever heard of an Elderly purchase shipped with loosened head tension.  They normally ship with a well-set up instrument and a loose head would not be in accordance with that.

The alternative, of course, is that the head loosened for an unknown reason, such as a head bead releasing.  It's not unheard of, and time will reveal that if that's the case.  I'd give Elderly a call and speak directly with someone to find out exactly what happened.  It's a relatively small crew there and it would be worth resolving.  If they may possibly have hired someone new who loosened the head then I'm sure they would want to follow that up with some instruction to whoever was responsible.  If it is a mechanical problem as a result of their setup then I'm sure that they would want to send you out a replacement head.

As far as setup goes it sounds like its a good match for you.  I'd personally go for 1/8" or a bit under, but that's pretty close to what you have and is somewhat determined on playing style.

Winged Words - Posted - 03/08/2017:  07:42:30

My Ramsey made it across the Atlantic from Elderly with head tensioned. From memory it was only slightly out of tune. (I've sorted that now.)

WaltV - Posted - 03/08/2017:  20:31:45

I did email Elderly and spoke to Jeff there. They definitely didn't check the head tension, and they said they should have. I emailed Bart Reiter also and he said the banjos are shipped with tight heads when they are new and they do stretch in and need to be tightened.

I've been reading a lot of threads about head tension and just don't get it. Tune it to G#? Tighten till it sounds good to my ears? Use a drum tensioner? I wish there were a good starting point. I may just take it to the luthier I use for guitar set ups and see if he knows banjos. Nevertheless, I'm super happy and my banjo teacher played it a bit and it sounded awesome when I was sitting in front of it. I'm really glad I got it.

twelvefret - Posted - 03/09/2017:  04:11:17

quote:

---

Originally posted by WaltV

 

I did email Elderly and spoke to Jeff there. They definitely didn't check the head tension, and they said they should have. I emailed Bart Reiter also and he said the banjos are shipped with tight heads when they are new and they do stretch in and need to be tightened.



I've been reading a lot of threads about head tension and just don't get it. Tune it to G#? Tighten till it sounds good to my ears? Use a drum tensioner? I wish there were a good starting point. I may just take it to the luthier I use for guitar set ups and see if he knows banjos. Nevertheless, I'm super happy and my banjo teacher played it a bit and it sounded awesome when I was sitting in front of it. I'm really glad I got it.

---

This is a very easy process if you have one of those little wrencheselderly.com/vega-style-banjo-b...?___SID=U. Just make sure to get the one that fits your hardware.

You tension like you tighen lug nuts, alternating. Have Elderly send you one. You'll need to learn how anyway in case you want to change the head. deeringbanjos.com/blogs/banjo-...anjo-head

plunkyjunkie - Posted - 03/09/2017:  06:18:25

  Funny, I received MY Buckbee from Elderly a few years ago and had two nuts drop off their hooks as i lifted out of the box for the first time! Strange feeling but literally the only questionable experience with the banjo in the 3 plus years I've had it. I love the banjo just as much as the day it was born. I put a JBalch skin head on it and a heavier bridge and it's just a perfect player for me.

  As for head tightening, the way I go about it is to tighten (in the cross pattern) just enough to keep the bridge from protruding very much out the underside of the head. Play it, have fun, and if by the next session if I think it needs tightened more, I'll make quarter turns with the wrench all the way around again.  The cross pattern tightening is the most important thing to get right in my opinion. Its good to eye a side profile of the tension hoop coming down onto the pot to make sure its even all around. I've never felt any need to 'dial' it in any more than that. 

erikstill - Posted - 03/09/2017:  08:35:28

Loose bolts and heads tend to happen in the cold months especially during shipping. cant beat physics. But this is a good chance for you to experiment with had tension. Find out what you like the snap of a tight head or the plunk of something looser. One of the many reasons I love the banjo, its sych a hands on instrument. Move things, tightening/loosen things, different head materials. Its all part of the experience. Enjoy!!!!

rudy - Posted - 03/09/2017:  09:44:29

quote:

---

Originally posted by WaltV

I did email Elderly and spoke to Jeff there. They definitely didn't check the head tension, and they said they should have. I emailed Bart Reiter also and he said the banjos are shipped with tight heads when they are new and they do stretch in and need to be tightened.



I've been reading a lot of threads about head tension and just don't get it. Tune it to G#? Tighten till it sounds good to my ears? Use a drum tensioner? I wish there were a good starting point. I may just take it to the luthier I use for guitar set ups and see if he knows banjos. Nevertheless, I'm super happy and my banjo teacher played it a bit and it sounded awesome when I was sitting in front of it. I'm really glad I got it.

---

Thanks for the follow-up.  I knew there was a logical explanation, and Elderly did drop the ball a bit on this one.

You may want to read the info that I wrote on basic open back set up procedure bluestemstrings.com/pageBanjoC...ips2.html">HERE. 

There's also a section on the website related to open back design with some additional head tightening information you might find useful.

Helix - Posted - 03/09/2017:  10:52:22

I like to lay the bridge over and slacken the strings some, but just a simple pressure change like that is enough to allow vibrations during shipping to enter in by degree. I see that no nuts fell off which, to me, shows great original assembly. Elderly is still number one.

I had one get blown over in a box car up in Flagstaff, it was only a day late, arrived in tact.

H Kimball - Posted - 03/09/2017:  15:36:28

I use a 5/16" wrench to tighten hooks and a 7 mm for the tailpiece. I had these and didn't buy the special wrench. The head will stretch some in humid, warm weather so may need to tighten depending upon conditions. I was playing my Buckbee with hide head outside last summer and had to tighten some. It's worth the extra effort if you like the hide heads.