flatfootjohnny - Posted - 06/03/2021:  09:30:20

Any ideas who might have made this? The pot is beech 11 1/2". The neck walnut 24" scale. Looks like the original pegs. I just need to make a new bridge and its playable.

 

flatfootjohnny - Posted - 06/03/2021:  09:33:27

More photos

 

flatfootjohnny - Posted - 06/03/2021:  09:35:34

The flange is screwed on

 

Alvin Conder - Posted - 06/03/2021:  09:39:22

I’m no expert on these early banjos, but I’m sure who made this, their name is lost to history.

Very nice and unusual instrument. I would place it at 1870’s.

I’m sure others, who know these better will chime in.

I will say that it looks in incredible preservation. Great that it is getting a new musical life.

Clifton Hicks - Posted - 06/03/2021:  10:16:16

I love it. Tempted to say R.A. Sanders but it ain't quite. Late Sanders, maybe. Just guessing.

IMBanjoJim - Posted - 06/03/2021:  11:45:44

Interesting that the Harmony bakelite banjos basically used the same idea 100 years later:

 

IMBanjoJim - Posted - 06/03/2021:  13:24:42

Johnny’s banjo has the same sort of wooden bracket band as the early Ashborn banjos. This passage, from frets.com, seems to say that the idea was never patented on either side of the Atlantic:

The Ashborn's most distinctive feature is the wooden bracket band - which eliminated the need for protruding bracket shoes - and protected the player's clothing from snags. As originally designed, the countersunk bracket nuts were
adjusted with a square key. Surprisingly, neither the innovative bracket band, nor the unique 3-piece
brackets seem to be patented. A similar bracket band is also used on some English banjos of the period - and there are some questions as to who used it first.

IMBanjoJim - Posted - 06/03/2021:  13:26:06

Here is the frets.com article:
frets.com/FretsPages/Museum/Ba...born.html

IMBanjoJim - Posted - 06/03/2021:  13:28:38

I am NOT implying this is an Ashborn banjo, only that it has similar characteristics.

Alvin Conder - Posted - 06/03/2021:  14:19:16

Jim is correct. Similar to Ashbourne, but I can say with about 100% confidence that it is not an Asbourne.

7 strings does point to an early British instrument. And I would tend to lean that it is British in make.

Pre or post Ashbourne is a good question.

flatfootjohnny - Posted - 06/03/2021:  14:42:27

Yes. 7 strings, beech pot suggest English

flatfootjohnny - Posted - 06/03/2021:  14:46:19

I have another similar to the Sanders banjo that Clifton mentioned... also made by butler(?) And possibly etherington with the wooden flange but they also have a wooden tension hoop screwed down with wood screws like the early Dobson

mike gregory - Posted - 06/03/2021:  15:16:02

Thanks for the pictures.
When the bridge is on, please post a video if it being played.

flatfootjohnny - Posted - 06/03/2021:  23:56:06

quote:

---

Originally posted by mike gregory

Thanks for the pictures.

When the bridge is on, please post a video if it being played.

---

Will do

IMBanjoJim - Posted - 06/08/2021:  17:32:04

Johnny was kind enough to sell me this fine old banjo. Should arrive in about a week. Gotta start thinking about what to tell the wife...

mike gregory - Posted - 06/09/2021:  06:05:04

Tell the wife that this banjo is not an ordinary 5-string, but is a SEVEN string, which was so badly treated by the other banjos, for being DIFFERENT, for being an UGLY DUCKLING, that it had to flee to asylum in the U.S. of A, where a banjo can be accepted for who he/she/it TRULY is, and doesn't have to be just like all the rest!

Alternatively: Send the wife to live with me and MY banjos for a month, after which time she'll be glad to return to a place which does NOT have an addition built on to it, specifically to provide storage space for banjii.

Joel Hooks - Posted - 06/09/2021:  06:35:20

quote:

---

Originally posted by IMBanjoJim

Johnny’s banjo has the same sort of wooden bracket band as the early Ashborn banjos. This passage, from frets.com, seems to say that the idea was never patented on either side of the Atlantic:



The Ashborn's most distinctive feature is the wooden bracket band - which eliminated the need for protruding bracket shoes - and protected the player's clothing from snags. As originally designed, the countersunk bracket nuts were

adjusted with a square key. Surprisingly, neither the innovative bracket band, nor the unique 3-piece

brackets seem to be patented. A similar bracket band is also used on some English banjos of the period - and there are some questions as to who used it first.

---

There is?  Someone has documentable evidence that a British builder was doing this before Ashborn?  Or enough evidence to call the origins into question?

jun3machina - Posted - 06/09/2021:  12:53:13

quote:

---

Originally posted by IMBanjoJim

Johnny was kind enough to sell me this fine old banjo. Should arrive in about a week. Gotta start thinking about what to tell the wife...

---

explain that the 7 strings are worth more than  a regular old five string. (she doesnt need to know the worth potentially equates to having to buy two packs of new strings VS just one )

Joel Hooks - Posted - 06/09/2021:  13:09:55

quote:

---

Originally posted by jun3machina

quote:

---

Originally posted by IMBanjoJim

Johnny was kind enough to sell me this fine old banjo. Should arrive in about a week. Gotta start thinking about what to tell the wife...

---

explain that the 7 strings are worth more than  a regular old five string. (she doesnt need to know the worth potentially equates to having to buy two packs of new strings VS just one )

---

Labella sells singles direct, it is all I use.

IMBanjoJim - Posted - 06/09/2021:  15:24:50

My favorite line is, ‘Look! Somebody sent me a banjo!’, which is technically true….

IMBanjoJim - Posted - 06/09/2021:  18:27:09

quote:

---

Originally posted by Joel Hooks

quote:

---

Originally posted by IMBanjoJim

Johnny’s banjo has the same sort of wooden bracket band as the early Ashborn banjos. This passage, from frets.com, seems to say that the idea was never patented on either side of the Atlantic:



The Ashborn's most distinctive feature is the wooden bracket band - which eliminated the need for protruding bracket shoes - and protected the player's clothing from snags. As originally designed, the countersunk bracket nuts were

adjusted with a square key. Surprisingly, neither the innovative bracket band, nor the unique 3-piece

brackets seem to be patented. A similar bracket band is also used on some English banjos of the period - and there are some questions as to who used it first.

---

There is?  Someone has documentable evidence that a British builder was doing this before Ashborn?  Or enough evidence to call the origins into question?

---

A fair question, Joel. I thought the frets.com article was interesting enough to quote. Maybe some of our British friends here can add their perspective on this question.

Stephen John Prior - Posted - 06/10/2021:  00:27:39

quote:

---

Originally posted by flatfootjohnny

I have another similar to the Sanders banjo that Clifton mentioned... also made by butler(?) And possibly etherington with the wooden flange but they also have a wooden tension hoop screwed down with wood screws like the early Dobson

---

I don't think Butler was a maker just a retailer John.

IMBanjoJim - Posted - 06/15/2021:  17:03:10

Just received the banjo, and one thing that surprised me is that the wooden ring around the outside of the pot is screwed on with screws going through from the inside of the pot. That is really interesting. I had assumed that the purpose of the wooden ring was so that no holes would need to be screwed through the pot.
So my question for anyone out there who has an Ashborn is, is the wooden ring glued on, or screwed?
No identifying marks on the banjo, except for a pencilled 3 inside the pot, in elegant script, where the rimstick meets the heel.

IMBanjoJim - Posted - 06/15/2021:  17:05:21

And the #3

 

IMBanjoJim - Posted - 06/15/2021:  17:31:40

For what it is worth, I just realized that another English banjo I have, a top tension, also has the wooden ring screwed on through the pot…

 

flatfootjohnny - Posted - 06/16/2021:  00:32:40

Ive been looking at Ashborn banjos and talking to a couple of makers. They are glued on, not screwed.. i think with a thin outer lamination either side (top and bottom) of the flange for extra support. Heres an oak one i made last summer ( i should probably finish it)