TYPO: 

Full length brass tailpieces help clean-up unwanted tones associated with steel strings and louder banjos.  no volume penalty.

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Originally posted by pinenut

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Originally posted by bFunk

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Originally posted by Dean T

I own a Goodtime, as well as a Sierra open back with a full blown tone ring. I love my Goodtime, but with the band or at jams, it’s like a tiny toy pop gun fighting with real guns. Seriously think about getting a tone ringed banjo, and return fire. Check out Steve Martin and his Clawgrass banjo, and how it cuts through the mix. My Sierra open back has the same tone ring, and it’s what I play out with.
youtube.com/watch?v=pMJxraw6KVM

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1)   I like the warm, simple tone of my Goodtime.   

2)  I'm not a big fan of the popcorn/hollow sound that I come across with some other (more expensive) banjos.

3)  Also, I've been completely spoiled by the Goodtime's light weight, but I'm willing to sacrifice that if it means being able to be heard more consistently. 

Is there a style of tone ring or banjo that is known for producing a simple, warm tone while producing more volume?  Yes.

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Goodtime Gumby with multiply rim.  This is a dead end for volume and tone; get a 'special' or add a rolled type brass ring for decent function.

Goodtime modern with 3-ply rim.  These are a quality rim and sound nice.  Volume on plain un-topped rims is weak.  Maybe, add a resonator to focus the volume that is produced (hollow/popcorn potential).  Using an amber head and/or wound third string will help with volume.

 

Heavy and the tone is set-up dependant.  Do what Dean says and get a full 3# flathead openback banjo; use a 'suede' head to warm-up the tone.  This set-up has a strong warm tone and is a good lesson for the right hand on volume control.  Be careful, one flathead on a good maple rim will swamp all of the guitars .

Lighter and the tone varies.  Whyte Laydie multi-piece types, rolled, exotic wood toppers and/or spun variants have better volume than simple wood.  These are a good compromise between a stage/performance oriented banjo and a simple wood rim.

Lighter and the tone is warm.  The Dobson/Bacon types mounted without a rolled ring underneath tend to be lower volume; like a Goodtime with better note separation.  These are living room gems.

notes: 

My current compromise for playing with others is an 11 x 3.5 x 5/8" 3-ply maple rim assembly, WL type ring, open-back, frosted head, full size brass tailpiece, wound third and compensated bridge.  It has a simple clean tone, enough volume to fully support a fiddle, or two, and can be dialed back for background fill.  

Wound third strengthens volume and maintains a warmer tone.  https://www.banjohangout.org/blog/37187

Compensated bridges support a warmer tone compared to the more edgy straight bridge, no volume penalties. 

Full length brass bridges help clean-up unwanted tones associated with steel strings and louder banjos.  no volume penalty.

Suede heads have a strong warm tone temperament with a small volume penalty.  

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Wow, thanks for all those details. Unfortunately my lack of technical knowledge means I'm a little bit fuzzy about some of the things you wrote:

1. When you use the terms "heavy" and "lighter", are you referring to string gauges or the actual weight of the banjo?

2. Can you simply add a tone ring on top of a Goodtime (or any other) wood rim? 

Thanks!

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Originally posted by bFunk

 

Wow, thanks for all those details. Unfortunately my lack of technical knowledge means I'm a little bit fuzzy about some of the things you wrote: 

It's not you, I was't clear...

 

1. When you use the terms "heavy" and "lighter", are you referring to string gauges or the actual weight of the banjo? 

Just the weight; banjos range from about 6-13ish pounds. 

Choose your strings to match what your ears and fingers tolerate best; strings are an inexpensive experiment that can radically change the color of an instrument.

 

2. Can you simply add a tone ring on top of a Goodtime (or any other) wood rim? 

Yes and not exactly.  The leading edge of the rim needs to have wood removed to accomodate the height of the ring without resetting the neck to rim connection.   

https://www.banjohangout.org/blog/37171     https://www.banjohangout.org/blog/37155

 

Thanks!

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Hi Bryce,

Which Goodtime model? (Gumby multiply or modern 3-ply)

What specific type of head material?

What is the head tension and is it being set with a drum dial or ruler/SteveDavis method or...?

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Originally posted by pinenut

Hi Bryce,

Which Goodtime model? (Gumby multiply or modern 3-ply)

What specific type of head material?

What is the head tension and is it being set with a drum dial or ruler/SteveDavis method or...?

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Hi Pinenut,

1. I have a Goodtime gumby model, approx 15 years old, so I assume it's the multiply?

2. I'm not sure what the head material is. I bought a head with a Kavanjo pickup mounted on it, so I assume it's this one (top frosted mylar):

https://www.deeringbanjos.com/products/kavanjo-banjo-pickup?srsltid=AfmBOoo7IIUiPpARRrYKnwwD-tEgKejK8a-Q5EUiZdeDHjsBRTwJdCSl

3. It's been years since I adjusted the head tension. How would you recommend I check it / adjust it?

Thanks for any advice, much appreciated.

-Bryce

I overlooked your having a Cavanjo head. Use it.

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Originally posted by bFunk

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Originally posted by pinenut

The head tension is set with a drum dial 91-92 or the ruler+coins Steve Davis method.

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Hi Pinenut,

1. I have a Goodtime gumby model, approx 15 years old, so I assume it's the multiply?  yes

2. I'm not sure what the head material is. I bought a head with a Kavanjo pickup mounted on it, so I assume it's this one (top frosted mylar):  

https://www.deeringbanjos.com/products/kavanjo-banjo-pickup?srsltid=AfmBOoo7IIUiPpARRrYKnwwD-tEgKejK8a-Q5EUiZdeDHjsBRTwJdCSl

3. It's been years since I adjusted the head tension. How would you recommend I check it / adjust it?  

Thanks for any advice, much appreciated.

-Bryce

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Is your guitar friend running some sort of pre-amp or stomp-box? 

Are you running some sort of powered processing?

1-3)  For plain acoustic playing with electric instruments; start with three pounds of bronze and a DrumDial measurement of 91-92 like Dean advised.  

Otherwise, with amplification and processing, focus on playability and the tone of your signal, maximize your system.

Deering discontinued Gumby Goodtimes in 2008, so it’s at least 18 years old. Mine is a 1999 model, and with a tight head, it still sounds pretty good. I’ve gigged with Goodtimes using a multi channel mix, and my own mic, but since we’ve gone to a single mic, there’s NO WAY it would work.

When a banjo head is new, it stretches considerably for several months. It slows down after about 6 months, and then stays pretty stable for years. I’ve been keeping mine at 90-91 on the drum dial. I check about every 6 months. I’ve seen them drop down to 88-89 over the course of a year or so. If you haven’t tightened your head in years, I’m betting it’s probably in the 83-85 range. If you tighten that head, you’re going to think you have a new banjo.

Something else you have to think of is wood timbre. I’ve spend a lot of money on a Tony pass wood block tone ring, and an all wood Deering Vega Bluegrass wonder. They sounded very loud at home, and ok during playing live, but I wanted to cry when listening to recordings, and the tone got assimilation by the guitars. I’ve wondered about Deerings Granadillo tone rings, but I don't want to spend another small fortune, only to be disappointed again.

Something else to be aware of, is that whenever you see the word “special” in the name of a Goodtime model, that means it has a lightweight tone ring. I’ve owned one. And it’s a little louder, and is going in the right direction, but still pales by comparison, to a full blown tone ring, in a live situation. In other words, before you spend money on a Goodtime “special” that may or may not work for you, I would recommend putting the money into a bell brass tone ring banjo, that will keep you happy and heard for a lifetime.

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Originally posted by Dean T

Deering discontinued Gumby Goodtimes in 2008, so it’s at least 18 years old. Mine is a 1999 model, and with a tight head, it still sounds pretty good. I’ve gigged with Goodtimes using a multi channel mix, and my own mic, but since we’ve gone to a single mic, there’s NO WAY it would work.

When a banjo head is new, it stretches considerably for several months. It slows down after about 6 months, and then stays pretty stable for years. I’ve been keeping mine at 90-91 on the drum dial. I check about every 6 months. I’ve seen them drop down to 88-89 over the course of a year or so. If you haven’t tightened your head in years, I’m betting it’s probably in the 83-85 range. If you tighten that head, you’re going to think you have a new banjo.

Something else you have to think of is wood timbre. I’ve spend a lot of money on a Tony pass wood block tone ring, and an all wood Deering Vega Bluegrass wonder. They sounded very loud at home, and ok during playing live, but I wanted to cry when listening to recordings, and the tone got assimilation by the guitars. I’ve wondered about Deerings Granadillo tone rings, but I don't want to spend another small fortune, only to be disappointed again.

Something else to be aware of, is that whenever you see the word “special” in the name of a Goodtime model, that means it has a lightweight tone ring. I’ve owned one. And it’s a little louder, and is going in the right direction, but still pales by comparison, to a full blown tone ring, in a live situation. In other words, before you spend money on a Goodtime “special” that may or may not work for you, I would recommend putting the money into a bell brass tone ring banjo, that will keep you happy and heard for a lifetime.

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As for the hartford grenadillo ring, i can say that it has plenty of cut and protection, in my Hartford resonator. (I have no idea what it would do as a replacement ).

I have a recording at a BG camp performance where i am on stage, 5-6 feet away from the single mic, playing soft back up, the guitarist, taking his solo, is right on top of the mic, and im still louder...!

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Originally posted by stevedenver

for the hartford grenadillo ring, i can say that it has plenty of cut and protection, in my Hartford resonator. (I have no idea what it would do as a replacement ).

I have a recording at a BG camp performance where i am on stage, 5-6 feet away from the single mic, playing soft back up, the guitarist, taking his solo, is right on top of the mic, and im still louder...!

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Oh man! ... several days ago Deering posted a custom blond Sierra, with a Granadillo tone ring, on their Facebook page... and my mind hasn't been able to rest since. Repeat after me... you don't need another banjo... you don't need another banjo...

You DO, you DO, you DO…….
Sounds beautiful, blond…with black binding?

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Originally posted by stevedenver

You DO, you DO, you DO…….
Sounds beautiful, blond…with black binding?

you didnt ask, but, imho, the 06 tone ring is superb, but, different than grenadillo

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Originally posted by stevedenver

You DO, you DO, you DO…….
Sounds beautiful, blond…with black binding?

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Here's the only picture they put up. Man, C'mon Deering, why you gotta tease me like this!? It's an open back Sierra. I own their stock open back maple Sierra with an 06 ring and it's what I play out with. It's taking all the self control I have, not to e-mail Deering for a quote on one like this. 
 

My apologies to bFunk for the thread drift!